URGENT - Update with another dumb Hondata Question

[McChook]

Quick dumb n00b question, but I need answers - OH, and I have already done a search and yielded no results.

If I buy a Hondata S100 -
a) how much are they worth new
b) do they come with everything to tune it

I maye have found one, used, but in Europe, and they guy doesn;t speak english, so I need some answers... AND QUICKLY.

Let me know, I need some info. By the way, I am searching the net now as well, so i thought I would double my chances...

Cheers
Matt

PS - will it be kool with a Prelude... duh, forgot...

[madgrk]

My mate got a quote on an S200 which is quite similar apparently, and he got quoted 1200 fitted and tuned through an approved installer/tuner. According to James (BLKCRX) the US Hondata units cant be tuned here because of a different code or something. Just make sure you dont get something that cant be tuned here! Otherwise it'll be a waste of your money :)

[McChook]

Hmmm....

[madgrk]

Yeah just check it out dude it will definently be worth your while. PM James and he will tell ya :)

[joneblaze]

James is currently in Sydney being a tuning hoe. Call him on 0417875785 Matt. He'll be Croydon tomorrow arvo too.
I hope he doesn't mind me disclosing stalker info. It's all more business i suppose. :)

[poid]

According to James (BLKCRX) the US Hondata units cant be tuned here because of a different code or something.

They would use the same code as the US Hondata, if it is the case that the aussie units need particular software then it would just be Hondata adding a little software lock so that we cant just import US units and get them tuned here.

[Morkz]

i was just in Sydney and got a quote from Advan for $1200 fitted, but dont go to croydon coz they were charging $1600. Or if ur in melbourne i got told to go to razz tech who would do it for $1200 as well

[totti]

i got quoted $1600 from James plus tuning is extra $300-400 :?

[McChook]

Hmm, cool

[madgrk]

According to James (BLKCRX) the US Hondata units cant be tuned here because of a different code or something.

They would use the same code as the US Hondata, if it is the case that the aussie units need particular software then it would just be Hondata adding a little software lock so that we cant just import US units and get them tuned here.

I'm not too sure if he said code or something else, but there is a difference he said. Whether its the coding or something no idea! 8)

[DarkCoupe]

about the fact that the US unit can NOT be used here ... in short ... that is a big load of shit ... I know two other people with civics and one with a DC5R which have got the US code and their car runs perfectly fine.

oh and do go paying close to 2000 bucks for something just because its from Aus ... I am all for supporting australian distributors but I don't like being ripped off ...

in the end .. up to you.

[BLKCRX]

Hey guys, sorry been interstate and away from a PC.

The s100 is a basic version of the s200 although it does not have the ability to support datalogging, the g sensor nor launch RPM and full throttle shift. The price difference is around 50$aust and everyone always chooses the s200 over the s100 system. Im not sure where you guys are getting your prices from, but everyone has the same prices Across Australia.

The Hondata s200 unit is $820.00 (incl GST) and installation, the Hondata ECU’s for post 96 cars and all preludes are $850.00, none of my resellers will undersell each other, that is why we have fixed pricing, irrespective of where you go.

http://www.hondata.com.au/Hondata_Retail_Pricing2004.pdf

For current retail for all products please download the following PDF file.

We don’t allow end users to tune Hondata s200 as quite frankly unless you’re a expert in EFI you shouldn’t be tuning anyway, so this option is not available in Australia. There also are slight differences in the software due to different sensors uses on Honda’s from 89 – 99.

Only authorized tuners can Tune Hondata period. Currently that’s Razz Tech Performance in Melbourne (In including My self) Redline Motor sports (Dave) in Sydney, Croydon Autosports (Jim) and APC-Racing (Nick) in Brisbane.

My Tuners will also only tune and support Australia Hondata units imported by Hondata Australia, no support or tuning will be done for units brought in from overseas, as we can not warranty nor support nor tune a product which is not ours, we also are under government ADR 37 regulation to only support Hondata Australian imported Units.

To cut a long story short you need to buy Hondata Products directly from an Official Authorized Reseller for Hondata Australia.

The DC5 Hondata units are another kettle of fish altogether we have not finished nor released this product yet, and are in the final stages of testing, these units are not s200 units and operate under a completely different way.

The DC5 (K series engine) Products are still under development still and no real pricing has been confirmed yet Australia, there are how ever major differences, between our (K series) which are mainly due to emission controls and ADR 37 regulations.

Regards James

[DarkCoupe]

can I just confirm ... is the prices you are quoting the complete ECU with the Hondata flash (so that I can keep my stock ECU seperate etc)

or

is the price just the cost for having my current ECU re-flashed?

[BLKCRX]

If your referring to the K product, then we are not flashing any ECU's in Australia, we physically modifying them locally or replacing them, it was decided a long time ago not to release the flash program as our programmable unit is under development, and a fully tunable option is better than any flash for Australia

Back on topic thow.. lets not turn this into a K ecu talk ;-) it was about the s100 / s200

If you’re talking about the s200 in most cases (post 96) a new ECU is supplied.

Regards James

[DarkCoupe]

ok ... back on the S200 ...

are you able to supple the Hondata S200 System with Stage 2 options (full tunability), with shift light option, VTEC Control and 3rd stage rev limiter etc? (if so how much for extra options)

also, on a similar topic ... how long would it take for installation and tuning (say I already have aftermarket cams and cam gears installed already etc) and what's the $$ for this? :)

[BLKCRX]

Hehe don’t you read PDF files ;-) they contain all the information.. James spoon-feeds you all again eheheh jk.

The 3step control launch rpm full throttle shift etc upgrade is $350 retail on top of the costs of the s200 and the Hondata plug in ECU (if required)

Tuning typically takes a minimum of 2 hours and is depended on what’s being tuned. IE tuning cam gears can take longer as you need to keep removing the valve cover to access them.

Regards James

[poid]

i dont think the fully tunable option is supplied in Australia is it James? Otherwise according to the pricelist on Hondata.com.au the 3-step limiter is an extra $350, boost is $475 and datalogging is $475.

that starts to add up!!

EDIT: d'oh beaten to it :P

[BLKCRX]

That’s correct.. actually i believe DarkCoupe got confused with fully adjustable rev limits, which is your launch RPM limit ;-) not tuning adjustments.

Regards James

[DarkCoupe]

alright. thanks james

[McChook]

thanks for the info.. I just sat on the sidelines and watched this continue...

[DarkCoupe]

James ... you may have already been asked this before ... but why does the US version of the S200 go for approximatly $250-300 US ($315 - 380 AU) where as here it's almost triple that?!?

[Weq]

Monopoly.

[BLKCRX]

No business can survive if they base items in Australia on the current exchange rate, business doesn’t work like that, what happens when the US $ goes down to .49cents where it was this time last year? Will the prices rise? Of corse not, there standardized prices for the Australia market, taking into consideration the Australia market and other available products. You also have to consider shipping costs, insrunace costs, duty costs, import tax, GST, currency conversion costs and many other things when importing or distributing a product which sometimes add’s up to more than the cost of the item !

Regards James

[DarkCoupe]

so no matter what happens in the marketplace, your prices will always remain the same?!?

[BLKCRX]

Every business try’s and keeps prices as stable as possible.

Take this as a typical example when importing something

Say you buy something which is 500US
If you assume the exchange rateis 70cents that’s 715$aust.


Here’s the hidden costs.

Shipping via Fedex is typical 100$us – 150$us for most small 3kg items, insurance for shipping can be 7% – 9% (of total valve including shipping)

International bank transfer fee’s $40aust or 3% extra on a credit card, (

So before the items even leave the USA your up for ($650+7% 695.5)
Converted into Aust $ ( at .70 cents ) is 993.57 plus the 3% on the credit card $1023.37Aust

Then once the items hit Australia you need to pay for duty clearance typically 50 – 80$ plus 15% import tax and 10% GST on the final price.

So to add up all the maths that’s $1023 + 60$(duty fee) = 1083 plus 15% import tax $1245, then you pay GST $1370.00aust

This is a more realistic price if converting US goods into Australia currency landed here in Australia, then you have internal shippings costs warranty etc and business costs to factor into things.

Regards James

[tinkerbell]

No business can survive if they base items in Australia on the current exchange rate, business doesn’t work like that, what happens when the US $ goes down to .49cents where it was this time last year? Will the prices rise? Of corse not,

Regards James

i think prices will rise because people (not necessarily you James) can be greedy when it comes to import parts and will try to jack prices up again...

there is not yet enough competition within the AUS market (due in part to a lack of demand) that this exploitation of price changes might occur...

it is to your benefit James that you appear an approachable and willing participant in the import modification scene that differentiates you from other 'faceless' vendors...

you are lucky at the moment to be enjoying such favourable FOREX prices and it is clear that you have factored such conditions into your business plan...

when the AUD does drop (and it will) you will be faced with decreased profit margins and will be tempted to increase prices to retain this extra income.

it is great to see you commit to this price structure - even if the AUD goes below 50c

[Rowie]

Marketing 101 :D

[..~VTECBoy~..]

somehow I am thinking most businesses (maybe even hondata) WILL raise their prices using the falling doller as the reason ... or myabe not ... whatever ...

[tinkerbell]

somehow I am thinking most businesses (maybe even hondata) WILL raise their prices using the falling doller as the reason ... or myabe not ... whatever ...

well - you heard it here, Hondata Australia will not be raising it s prices!!!

[BLKCRX]

This Forum is great….. not only technical car help ! but technical financial help.
But yes any business needs to look at the over all picture, not just the day to day picture…. As for how low the US $ will go, only time will tell…


Regards James

[McChook]

Hmm

Now, since I own a late model Prelude, I need an ODB1 ECU, because mine is ODB2 corect??

Can I just buy a standard ODB1 ECU from a DC2 Integra GSi?? Or other compatable Standard ECUs? If not, why not??

Also, if I was to buy a "hondata intake manifold gasket", which inlets is it compatable to??

Cheers

[poid]

as far as i know a P28 will be fine

[94vtirozguy]

p28 , p72 are your best options with p72 being best choice.

[McChook]

sweet

hmm, think I have a way to save even more cash...

[DarkCoupe]

James ... you may have already been asked this before ... but why does the US version of the S200 go for approximatly $250-300 US ($315 - 380 AU) where as here it's almost triple that?!?

Monopoly.

Sad fact is ... this is probably true ... Hondata in Australia can charge whatever price they like ... because no one else *so far* provides the Hondata product in Australia.


This Forum is great….. not only technical car help ! but technical financial help.

I hope you're talking about someone else, because I certainly didn't ask for any financial or business advice from you. I was trying to see how you justify such drastic differences in local versus overseas pricing. And to be honest, I am not convinced, and belive me, I have asked around ... I am not alone.

[McChook]

HEY, ENOUGH HIJACKING!!! :evil:

[DarkCoupe]

Sorry. You're right (I was just finishing off :P)

Back to the topic :D

[mpd076-chuck]

I hope you're talking about someone else, because I certainly didn't ask for any financial or business advice from you. I was trying to see how you justify such drastic differences in local versus overseas pricing. And to be honest, I am not convinced, and belive me, I have asked around ... I am not alone.

hey man... i don't quite see why this attitude is justified. How many other ECU representatives are on this board? How many answer questions in detail? How many are passionate about Honda's?

Everything James wrote about importing is true. Convert to AU$, pay shipping costs, pay 15% car parts import duty, pay GST.... by my calculations that's at least AU$600 per ECU with a VERY favourable FOREX rate - without factoring insurance or general business costs.

Why don't you start importing the AEM EMS and learn it, get it approved and then start up a nationwide network before complaining about somebody who is working their butt off???

edit: i have never met James and have no affiliation.

[DynoDave]

There already is a AEM dealer here in Australia and the price for the ECU is around $2600 retail sorry just had to say it.
Regards Dyno Dave

[mpd076-chuck]

There already is a AEM dealer here in Australia and the price for the ECU is around $2600 retail sorry just had to say it.
Regards Dyno Dave

Well thats cool, but why does it cost AU2600 when US retail is 1300? ;)

And I don't see them on here helping the honda community like James...

[McChook]

:oops:

[mpd076-chuck]

hey mcChook i was just trying to crack a joke about the AEM price... :)

It is pretty handy to have the actual hondata distributor ready to answer questions in his spare time.

[DynoDave]

Humour is good :D

[McChook]

Humour is good :D
sarcasm sucks when you missed it, you abuse someone then feel like a tool when you realise they were joking

[eknine]

maybe one reason is selling like it is the best in the world and to make the months sales:)....who know..i'm only a post whore <laffz>

[BLKCRX]

Humour is very good !

laugh'ing at all the internet experts !

Regards James

[Jim80y]

Can I just buy a standard ODB1 ECU from a DC2 Integra GSi?? Or other compatable Standard ECUs? If not, why not??



Sorry to bring up an old thread, but need an answer to this question. Can I buy a p28 ecu from joe blow, by the S200 from a Hondata dealer and have a authorized Hondata tuner tune it?

[McChook]

How do you plan on obtaining an S200.

[Jim80y]

Planning to buy Hondata from Hondata Australia but source ECU elsewhere. Depends on whether Hondata Australia tuners will still tune my car if the ECU I get is not from Hondata Australia.

[McChook]

Can;t answer that question.

Where are you located??

[BLKCRX]

A ECU is a stock Honda item, anyone can supply that, although they do require modification socketing and soldering up to accept Hondata, Around $250 depending on which workshop. Any of my resellers can help you out. We sell ecu's for $550rrp which have already been modified and come with warranty which will plug straight in, or $850 for post 1996 Hondas

To buy a new ECU from Honda costs $3000

Regards James