Buddyclub or Skunk cams

[dohctor]

Hey guys.

I currently have a stock B20z vtec, and am wondering which cams would work best. Buddyclub Spec 3 or a skunk2 stg 1? Only mods include i/h/e and a blox intake manifold. The head is also skimmed .5mm.

Thanx.

[Waggy]

Stage 1s are very mild cams, they will still work well and give you gains but not much. There are plenty of other cams that will suit your application a bit "better" but out of the two I would suggest the BC's.

It also depends on what you want out of the car/future mods/what it will be used for etc.

[Drew]

Skunk2, its in the name...

[joewalsh86]

You should probably let us know the compression and which pistons you used, maybe also the headgasket and current valvetrain. The type of header and current intake would also be helpful. Its faily hard to tell you which cams (which are only slightly different themselves) would suit your engine with such limited information :D

Joe

[DR HONDA]

BAng for buck and reliabilty to go id advise the skunk 2 specially with a full built engine

[fatboyz39]

skunk2 stage 1 cams are very nice for a stock b20z bottom end.

[dohctor]

You should probably let us know the compression and which pistons you used, maybe also the headgasket and current valvetrain. The type of header and current intake would also be helpful. Its faily hard to tell you which cams (which are only slightly different themselves) would suit your engine with such limited information :D

Joe


My bad joe.

Ok, its a stock B20Z, stock valve train, oem headgasket. Thing is, im in South Africa and these parts are damn expensive. I previously had a fully built ls/vtec which gave me endless hassles. Im not planning on doing much more and just want a mild cam without needing to change valvetrain.:thumbsup:

The header is a 4-1 wildcat header. Here is a pic.:o

http://usera.imagecave.com/dohctor/7.bmp.jpg

Thanx guys.

[dsp26]

if your after cheaper cams and only after non pro series skunk2 cams...

look into the OBX copies.. made of better chromoly material and half the price and exact same specs for stage 1,2,3 (NON PRO series)

[dohctor]

A pic of my car.:o

http://usera.imagecave.com/dohctor/6.bmp.jpg
http://usera.imagecave.com/dohctor/4.bmp.jpg

[dohctor]

if your after cheaper cams and only after non pro series skunk2 cams...

look into the OBX copies.. made of better chromoly material and half the price and exact same specs for stage 1,2,3 (NON PRO series)

Will see if anyone in Cape town South africa can get me a set.:thumbsup:

[joewalsh86]

Nice car, looks pretty clean and decent mods too.

In terms of the cams, you can't really go wrong with either in my opinion. I agree with above - look into the Blox copies or the Skun 2 Stage 1's. A friend of mine has a set of Skunk2 stage one's in his 'home made' B20 vtec; compression is around the 10.5 to 11.0 mark, and the midrange is nice and strong. Let us know how they go, especially if you get it tuned!

[dohctor]

Nice car, looks pretty clean and decent mods too.

In terms of the cams, you can't really go wrong with either in my opinion. I agree with above - look into the Blox copies or the Skun 2 Stage 1's. A friend of mine has a set of Skunk2 stage one's in his 'home made' B20 vtec; compression is around the 10.5 to 11.0 mark, and the midrange is nice and strong. Let us know how they go, especially if you get it tuned!

Thanx man. It is booked for a tune on the 9th, so im keeping fingers crossed. My buddy put his B20 on the dyno today for a power run and it made 154kw and 200nm Atf. untuned. He has skunk2 stg 1 cams in his though.:thumbsup:

[skunk2tony]

I'd say go with the Skunk2 Pro 1 Cams also you should get the compression up a bit more to about 11.0 or 11.2. I also might add that you want to change out the pistons on that B20 since its the weak point of the motor...

[dohctor]

I'd say go with the Skunk2 Pro 1 Cams also you should get the compression up a bit more to about 11.0 or 11.2. I also might add that you want to change out the pistons on that B20 since its the weak point of the motor...

Its a B20z which has a bit higher comp and this is a brand new sub assembly. I dont plan on opening up this motor at all, had too much issues with my ls/vtec.

Thanx for the help guys.

[ZeForce]

I'd say go with the Skunk2 Pro 1 Cams also you should get the compression up a bit more to about 11.0 or 11.2. I also might add that you want to change out the pistons on that B20 since its the weak point of the motor...

Bit of a bias response dont you think....


I am considering using BC spec 3 cams for my B20VTEC I think they would work well even with the lowish compression of the std pistons. Plus they are cheaper :thumbsup:

[fatboyz39]

Bit of a bias response dont you think....


I am considering using BC spec 3 cams for my B20VTEC I think they would work well even with the lowish compression of the std pistons. Plus they are cheaper :thumbsup:

Yeah BC spec 3 works well with low comp like yours. We built a B20 very similar to your setup, well nearly identical but with BC spec 3 and it worked really well. Manage a 13.6@103MPH with fuel issues in a CRX.

[dohctor]

Yeah BC spec 3 works well with low comp like yours. We built a B20 very similar to your setup, well nearly identical but with BC spec 3 and it worked really well. Manage a 13.6@103MPH with fuel issues in a CRX.

Thanx guys for alll ur advice. Appreciate it.:thumbsup:

Gonna get the BC 3s.

[kraiye]

good choice

i actually disagree with the s2 pro1 cams... i got ctr pistons and built head - screamer on the h/way but not too daily driver friendly

[dohctor]

good choice

i actually disagree with the s2 pro1 cams... i got ctr pistons and built head - screamer on the h/way but not too daily driver friendly

Wud it be a tad overkill if i used the spec 4s? I might increase comp with aftermarket pistons at a later stg. Also as far as valve springs go, what is a good choice? I know toda, but as far as price goes what would be a good choice?

[ZeForce]

I have heard supertech valve springs are good value for money

You have PM

[pwr2w8]

i wouldn't take OBX cams even if they were given to me for free, in regards to skunk2 or BC3 , i would look into blox stage b , they will be better price and will give you better power for your setup, if you were to run higher compression like over 12.5 jun 3 will be your best bet

[dsp26]

i wouldn't take OBX cams even if they were given to me for free, in regards to skunk2 or BC3 , i would look into blox stage b , they will be better price and will give you better power for your setup, if you were to run higher compression like over 12.5 jun 3 will be your best bet

pretty stupid statement considering their the exact same (SK2s2, OBXs2, BLOXs2) specs yet OBX uses better chromoly material, SK2 uses chill cast oem blanks and Blox uses oem blanks.

Int - 12.3 mm lift, duration 266 @ 1mm
Exh - 11.8 mm lift, duration 262 @ 1mm

[fatboyz39]

ill take cams if there free!!...

[dohctor]

I have heard supertech valve springs are good value for money

You have PM

Thanx. So i shud not use the spec4 BC then.

[pwr2w8]

i dare you to use obx cams, go f--k your motor, a mate had an experience with them and there were absoultely shit

Read and do some reaserch

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1344659

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=2047004

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1870861

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1622867

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1251090

and i can go on, so before you shoot your mouth of and give NO IDEA advise, do some research buddy!!!!!




pretty stupid statement considering their the exact same (SK2s2, OBXs2, BLOXs2) specs yet OBX uses better chromoly material, SK2 uses chill cast oem blanks and Blox uses oem blanks.

Int - 12.3 mm lift, duration 266 @ 1mm
Exh - 11.8 mm lift, duration 262 @ 1mm

[dsp26]

i dare you to use obx cams, go f--k your motor, a mate had an experience with them and there were
absoultely shit
^^^how are they shit? please elaborate? coz their an exact replica of the non Pro series skunk2... yours and your friends opinion? so.. if your friend was to have put the Blox ones in are they any better? camshafts have to be matched to a specific setup.. like what would happen if i put TODA Cs in a stock B16a?? that would be shit but their great aggresive cams for a specific purpose and powerband and setup.. they just don't run on their own.

Read and do some reaserch

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1344659
^^^if you read the first post and if you knew what it was about before posting it, you'd realise straight away this was a valve spring issue. if the camshaft had broken then i understand.

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=2047004
^^^again opinions from people who know nothing.. 'e-mechanics'. xs-power is a subsidiary of the infamous SS Autochrome brand that does what OBX does in copying work but with shitty work. i also know from personal experience with one of their products. In terms of camshafts though, at least OBX used better material while copying Skunk2.


http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1870861
^^^same issue as below. But for the cost of these chromoly OBXs + new rockers, it offsets the weaker oem billet that blox use... why pay for something of inferior material quality.

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1622867
^^^mixed review of people who actually used it in the thread. rocker issue is completely understandable due to the chromoly material. thank you for posting it coz now i know to get upgraded rockers too next time :)


http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1251090
^^^has nothing to do with camshafts that are direct copies of an R&D skunk2 item

and i can go on, so before you shoot your mouth of and give NO IDEA advise, do some research buddy!!!!!

1. read my sig
2. i've used obx cams in sr20 (JWT copies) and have personal experience. i did have problems with my motor after install but was related to cooling issues.
3. OBX actually won some 'quality awards last year at SEMA
4. OBX is an American company
5. the examples above ar e-mechanic bandwagoning
6. your opinion is yours based on your research.. fine... mine is on personal experience and feasibility choice/research
7. don't give advise or statements on an item or procedure that you yourself personally know nothing about. advise is good but it's pointless giving secondhand info if you know not of what you speak.
8. and yes i've read some of those links you've posted above before. obviously it took you a while to search for them as last minute defense... brings me back to my main point. understand what your talking about and posting before you do post them :thumbsup:
9. i did my research, som of which are above... you?

[fatboyz39]

Thanx. So i shud not use the spec4 BC then.

spec 4 will require valve train i.e springs, retainers to be upgraded.

[ZeForce]

spec 4 will require valve train i.e springs, retainers to be upgraded.

Wouldnt you have to upgrade valve springs when using the BC spec3 cams as well?

[pwr2w8]

OBX product's are shit, face it, they copy everybody and don't do any R&D , they have 1 good product and that's there LSD, but once again its not there product its copied and its made by the subies in china.
They even copied GFB boost controller, they have no R&D department and all there products are made in china, where as SKUNK, BC, BLOX and ect are made by factories in taiwan who happen to manufacture for some of the leading japanese companies, like i said OBX wouldn,t take it even if it was free, NO R&D and shit quality with shit finishes

[grumpy rooster]

Thats a totally ridiculous attitude to take. I wouldn't use every product OBX make but some are good, eg the LSD. And that's from personal experience.

I'd also be careful taking as gospel everything the US guys say. They are great bandwagon jumpers. :p

[fatboyz39]

Wouldnt you have to upgrade valve springs when using the BC spec3 cams as well?

Well depends what valve train you have. We had no issues with ITR valve springs/valve/retainers with BC sepc 3.

[dsp26]

OBX product's are shit, face it, they copy everybody and don't do any R&D , they have 1 good product and that's there LSD, but once again its not there product its copied and its made by the subies in china.
They even copied GFB boost controller, they have no R&D department and all there products are made in china, where as SKUNK, BC, BLOX and ect are made by factories in taiwan who happen to manufacture for some of the leading japanese companies, like i said OBX wouldn,t take it even if it was free, NO R&D and shit quality with shit finishes
That's exactly my point and your correct in that statement..

my feasibility on recommendation is primarily based on:
- The fact they can sell for cheaper and still use better materials BECAUSE they don't do R&D and simply copy. Is that not why we purchase copy products from OBX, Blox, Megan Racing, Hytech Headers, etc... Skunk2 started from the same humble begins like all these others with only really JUN and TODA once upon a time being the big players back in the days.
The R&D issue is exactly why their feasible for the tite-arses like most of us in the Honda community and it is why I assumed you were also recommending Blox in the first place as they are no better in that department. The original point i was making with what you quoted was what makes Blox better than the OBX version when they are the exact same (Skunk2) but the OBX camshaft had one obvious advantage of metallurgical quality?

- OBX camshafts are still over US$100 cheaper than Blox despite both being well under half price of the original Skunk2s. The OP hinted that he is on a budget and considered Skunk2 as one of his options in the first place despite him already deciding to go with BCs3s

- Although you (probably unkowingly) brought up the rocker arm issue in one of the threads you quoted, this isn't a significant threat, as worn rockers (the part that slides over the cam lobes) would simply wear and prevent the valves from opening all the way to the camshafts fill lift capacity. This is easily noticed on the dyno or how the car runs/struggles.

- Although I considered a Blox product once (their intake manifolds) which are again ITR copies anyway, in terms of reputation OBX just won out for me
- And admittedly those are my opinions based on options that are weighed out for feasibility.

and as grumpy rooster said, i wouldn't take what those US forum ppl say as gospel, though the quote in my sig is from a US member of OzHonda :) a lot of his posts make a lot of sense compared to the majority of US forum e-mechanics. In your friends case.. it sucked... in comparison to what? It depends on what else he had with which spec camshaft.

[dohctor]

spec 4 will require valve train i.e springs, retainers to be upgraded.

yeah i know, thing is my mechanic told me the spec 4s are not going to work well with my setup and i shud rather get skunk2 stg 1s.

These OBX cams, how much do they go for? And are they direct copies of skunk cams. Havnt heard of them before in South Africa.

[kraiye]

quick search found US$325 on ebay (+ postage of course)
stage 1, 2 or 3

part of the description is below...


" PLEASE SPECIFY THE CAMSHAFT STAGE YOU WANT WITH YOUR PAYMENT OR STAGE I WILL BE SENT

Type: Stage I
Part Number: 10117
Lift/Duration: IN. 0456, 252; EX. 0.426, 249
Notes: Valvetrain upgrade recommended

Type: Stage II
Part Number: 10115
Lift/Duration: IN. 0485, 266; EX. 0.466, 262
Notes: Valvetrain upgrade required

Type: Stage III
Part Number: 10116
Lift/Duration: IN. 0504, 270; EX. 0.465, 279
Notes: Valvetrain upgrade required

# Aggressive lobe setting for racing applications

# Larger lift produces maximum horsepower at all rpm ranges

# Precision machined from forged billet 4130 chrome moly steel rod

# Lightweight hollow design for optimum torque

# Computer balanced for smooth idling

# Compatible with naturally aspirated engines, turbo or supercharged engines

# Lifetime warranty against all manufacturer defects "

[dsp26]

quick search found US$325 on ebay (+ postage of course)
stage 1, 2 or 3

part of the description is below...


" PLEASE SPECIFY THE CAMSHAFT STAGE YOU WANT WITH YOUR PAYMENT OR STAGE I WILL BE SENT

Type: Stage I
Part Number: 10117
Lift/Duration: IN. 0456, 252; EX. 0.426, 249
Notes: Valvetrain upgrade recommended

Type: Stage II
Part Number: 10115
Lift/Duration: IN. 0485, 266; EX. 0.466, 262
Notes: Valvetrain upgrade required

Type: Stage III
Part Number: 10116
Lift/Duration: IN. 0504, 270; EX. 0.465, 279
Notes: Valvetrain upgrade required

# Aggressive lobe setting for racing applications

# Larger lift produces maximum horsepower at all rpm ranges

# Precision machined from forged billet 4130 chrome moly steel rod

# Lightweight hollow design for optimum torque

# Computer balanced for smooth idling

# Compatible with naturally aspirated engines, turbo or supercharged engines

# Lifetime warranty against all manufacturer defects "

I actually asked this seller how much shipping is to Australia... US$80 insured and express.

Therefore ~AU$420 delivered to Australia with current exchange rates for anyone interested

[eight]

any significant change with the stage 1 drop ins without a tune?

this is on a b18c7 motor

[dsp26]

any significant change with the stage 1 drop ins without a tune?

this is on a b18c7 motor

what do you mean? valvetrain requirements (No) or performance gain (bit more than itr cams)?

[jugbugz]

Anyone experienced the Skunk2 Pro 1 cam? I have this waiting to be installed onto my b16b with Toda Valve springs, toda cam gears and SPOON head gasket. Advice and exp wiith these cams please!

[dohctor]

I eventually fitted skunk 2 stg 1s, they feel gud, not tuned though. Still have the bc spec 4s and am damn curious 2 see how they wud fair. If only money grew on trees.:D

[dsp26]

Anyone experienced the Skunk2 Pro 1 cam? I have this waiting to be installed onto my b16b with Toda Valve springs, toda cam gears and SPOON head gasket. Advice and exp wiith these cams please!

there is one here:
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=91415

please do not post questions in that thread.. PM the member (kraiye)

[kraiye]

yeah dude... PM me :p

are u in Bris? can go for a drive if you like

[jugbugz]

I eventually fitted skunk 2 stg 1s, they feel gud, not tuned though. Still have the bc spec 4s and am damn curious 2 see how they wud fair. If only money grew on trees.:D

I'm guessing those were Tuner Stg 1, it impossible to run Pro 1 cams without tune.

Thanks guys!

[kraiye]

does anyone actually know what stage 1, 2, 3 etc even means? some yank thing isn't it?
pro1 def aint "stage1" ;)

[jugbugz]

does anyone actually know what stage 1, 2, 3 etc even means? some yank thing isn't it?
pro1 def aint "stage1" ;)

Yeh, Skunk has 2 series(levels)

-Tuner series
-Pro series

Pro Series are newer in technology and are much more aggressive. The Pro stg 1 cams have the same top end(but more) as the Tuner stg 2 except the Pro series have larger primaries to lift the bottom-mid range power.

They also have their high ramp technology which promotes more power at the vtec transition or something like that.

I personally like to use newer cams since they always have a more solid foundation of borrowed technology etc. I prefered this over TODA cams. Its just a personal opinion.

[dohctor]

I'm guessing those were Tuner Stg 1, it impossible to run Pro 1 cams without tune.

Thanks guys!

Yes, tuner series.

[dohctor]

So i finally had my car tuned this week. Im quite happy with the results. She made 161kw and 218nm atf. :thumbsup:

[kraiye]

what about atw?

[dsp26]

what about atw?

multiply by 85% ~136wkw.. by Aussie dyno standards.. multiply by 75% ~120wkw

***EDIT***
but i have to say thats great power for Tuner 1s as well as being in South Africa.. last i read on a few other forums your climate and altitude above sea level wasn't really helping for performance?? on a b16 too....

what else does the motor have done?

[kraiye]

either way, congrats :thubsup: and enjoy. I bet it's a fun little toy! plenty of torque!

[dohctor]

multiply by 85% ~136wkw.. by Aussie dyno standards.. multiply by 75% ~120wkw

***EDIT***
but i have to say thats great power for Tuner 1s as well as being in South Africa.. last i read on a few other forums your climate and altitude above sea level wasn't really helping for performance?? on a b16 too....

what else does the motor have done?

Well im @ the coast, in cape town so it doesnt affect us like in joburg. Nothing else done besides, i/h/e and fpr.:thumbsup: